Phyllis Chesler has written one of the most depressing posts I've read in a long time. ("The Coming Civil War in America.") Chesler paints an America I would hate to live in, of two hopelessly irreconcilable "cultures" -- each of which is basically at war with the other:
Each of the Presidential candidates and those who support them are fighting for the soul of America. Each has a radically different world view; each inhabits a radically different culture. They listen to different music, watch different movies, read different media. Each mainly socializes only with others who are like themselves. They do not talk to those with whom they disagree and when they do, it is often with anger and contempt.
I have lived in both worlds. I still do. There are good people on both sides of the great divide. Nevertheless, their values and tastes are different. One world is a glittering and violent urban metropolis where one can lead an anonymous life-or reach for the stars. The other world is a Small Town where everyone knows everybody's "business," prays together, helps out in emergencies, joins the civilian fire department, and usually joins the Army.
And here's a newsflash for you: Some people can live in a large city psychologically even if they live in a small town and vice versa.
If I thought America really was about two hopelessly different cultures, I'd leave.
Let me admit my bias: as I have said numerous times, I am an admitted traitor to the damnable, despicable "Culture War." There should not be any "war" at all based on tastes and values. These things are personal. This is supposed to be a free country based on the Constitution and respect for individuality, not identity groups filled with like-minded conformist assholes who can't wait to grab power so they can impose their competing value systems on the other side.
I think that most Americans (regardless of their individual tastes) reject such tribalist nonsense, and if I didn't think so, it would be time for me to consider moving to another country. Otherwise, if I stay here, I can look forward to being a traitor, and if a war starts over this nonsense, I will do my best to betray both sides, as I have nothing but contempt for people who would go to war over tastes and (gag) values. (A weasel word I hate so much I grabbed it as a satirical blog name six years ago -- my reasons remaining as misunderstood now as then, much to my delight.)
So, much as I'd like to be dismissive, thoughts like this worry me:
If McCain wins-I predict that the cultural wars will not only intensify but will turn into the beginnings of the next Civil War in America.
I sincerely hope McCain wins, and I certainly hope Phyllis Chesler is wrong.
What kind of culture war are we talking about? A war over what, exactly? Conservative SWAT teams breaking down liberal doors in search of forbidden values? Or vice versa?
Before we start shooting each other, I think we all ought to take a deep breath.
For God's sake, even the dreaded Sarah Palin smoked pot.
(Something to remember before we exhale.)
MORE: "The tedious Dr. Laura" disapproves of Sarah Palin's pregnancies, which Roger L. Simon sees as "another reason to like Palin." (Via Glenn Reynolds.)
What's up with that? Can't they even agree on the "values" they're supposed to be imposing on everyone else?
A hell of a way to run a civil war, I'd say....
NEWSFLASH: The civil war may have suffered another setback.
Palin's running mate, John McCain, and the GOP platform say children should be taught that abstinence until marriage is the only safe way to avoid pregnancy and disease. Palin's position is less clear.
In a widely quoted 2006 survey she answered during her gubernatorial campaign, Palin said she supported abstinence-until-marriage programs. But weeks later, she proclaimed herself "pro-contraception" and said condoms ought to be discussed in schools alongside abstinence.
"I'm pro-contraception, and I think kids who may not hear about it at home should hear about it in other avenues," she said during a debate in Juneau.
Such statements could raise concerns among social conservatives who have been some of Palin's most enthusiastic supporters since she was tapped for the No. 2 spot on the GOP ticket last week.
I'll say. What I'm unable to discern is whether she's always been condom friendly, or whether she's gone wobbly since she became governor.
Dr Laura has only one child. She doesn't understand breeders. Some of us like sitting at home with our children around, talking to them, watching with them, teaching them. If your children are not around, you find someone where you can sit with their children, or you visit your grandchildren.
I am watching a 4 year old eat ravioli right now, as she watches football, and I listen to it.
It will be the same civil war that happened in the late sixties and early seventies. Don't think ACW, think the IRA in the UK and northern Ireland or the SLA or Black Panthers.
And sure, I can easily see the Left, if they lose, trying to start it up again.
You would think they would lose, as they did the first time, but the establishment left is much more leftist now then it was then... so who knows?
ray · September 7, 2008 6:16 PM
True, ray, they'll try to start it again. They already have. However, without the specter of the Vietnam War to drive young people into their camp, they're going to have a hard time attracting more than a tiny fringe. I expect them to become far more shrill if McCain wins... it should be fun to watch, if nothing else.
Add to the list of possibility that you don't understand the issues of school sex education.
Consider the possibility that it is not the mechanics of condom use that are objectionable, but rather it is the values (or more likely, the lack of them) that are taught along with the mechanics.
I don't know what the curriculum is now, but in the past, we not only taught how to use a hammer, we taught when it was appropriate to use a hammer.
Larry Sheldon · September 7, 2008 7:44 PM
You can see it today in Pakistan and Thailand and Ukraine. Thank the spirits I live in peaceful, free, and united China. Free especially of loony dim libs. We went thru that phase. Never again
bob burns · September 7, 2008 7:56 PM
I just hope we institute a formal feminine hygiene education program. If they don't teach it in schools, girls will be bleeding all over the place never having known what a tampon is.
After all, its an uncomfortable subject. Its critical that public school teachers(the smartest humans on the planet)be relied upon to impart this information. Parents simply aren't up to the task.
Know what I'm sayin'?
ccoffer · September 7, 2008 8:58 PM
Phyllis Chesler is incorrect. The Culture Wars will intensify if Obama is elected as the radical Left has been even more enthusiastic about imposing their views on the public through the law than the Christian Right. Though Obama tries to hide it, from the lips of his mother to Wright and Ayers his associations and sympathies are and have been with the Radical Left. Witness the talk about the fairness doctrine and the desire to increase the reach of hate speech legislation. I believe the Religious Right's political power has waned as evidenced by Pat Robertson's willingness to overlook Guiliani's pro-choice position-- not to mention Rick Warren's rise to evangelical leadership. It had become more important for "his side" to retain political power than to pick someone whose views aligned with his on one of the defining issues of the Culture Wars. This does not mean that their power overall has decreased just that their ability to drive the political process has shrunk considerably. This is a good thing in my opinion. Political activists tend to hang around long after they've outworn their welcome. Like an artist unable to finish his work because he lacks the discipline to deny the urge to dable one more time to perfect it, too often they don't walk in their own victories and begin to poison the well they initially tried to heal. However if under threat by more liberal legislation from an Obama administration with solid control of Congress and thus 2 new liberal Supremes they will be galvanized again to enter politics as they were before.
Greg McDowall · September 7, 2008 11:06 PM
I think that most Americans (regardless of their individual tastes) reject such tribalist nonsense
I disagree. The Politically Correct Multiculturalism that the left pushes into every sphere of politics and public discourse is explicitly tribalist and explicitly intended to break down our cultural and political institutions.
Bob Smith · September 7, 2008 11:27 PM
Well, I don´t even know whether their values are so different from each other, not even they really got something we would call values (I am talking about politicians). They are driven only be egoistical issues, seeking for power. Just tell me why no one of the presidents would forbid gun possesion? Because of the right to self-defense? Pff, there must be much trust in the abilities of american authorities. But that´s not true, it´s just because of the gun industrie. and that´s only one example. Well, glad to not live in the US.
Unfortunately, it's not a free country, just more free than the competition.
A free country doesn't declare periodic wars upon segments of its citizenry, looting and incarcerating them for the pleasure of a real or purported majority.
The Anti-Idiotarian Rottweiler
Don?t bang your head!
Dr Laura has only one child. She doesn't understand breeders. Some of us like sitting at home with our children around, talking to them, watching with them, teaching them. If your children are not around, you find someone where you can sit with their children, or you visit your grandchildren.
I am watching a 4 year old eat ravioli right now, as she watches football, and I listen to it.