It's the numbers, stupid!

I am getting a bit tired of the seemingly endless attempts to discern the moral intent of the voters -- so tired of it that I don't even want to write this post.

From a practical Machiavellian perspective, it really doesn't matter whether the voters "voted against corruption" or whether in fact Iraq was "issue number one" because the result is a shift in the balance of power, and the result entirely predictable. That's why (for reasons I tried to explain in post after post), I voted the straight Republican ticket for the first time in my life. I realized that it would all come down to numbers and if the Democrats got the majority, it would come down to this:

WASHINGTON, Nov. 12 -- Democratic leaders in the Senate vowed on Sunday to use their new Congressional majority to press for troop reductions in Iraq within a matter of months, stepping up pressure on the administration just as President Bush is to be interviewed by a bipartisan panel examining future strategy for the war.

The Democrats -- the incoming majority leader, Senator Harry Reid of Nevada; the incoming Armed Services Committee chairman, Senator Carl Levin of Michigan; and the incoming Foreign Relations Committee chairman, Senator Joseph R. Biden Jr. of Delaware -- said a phased redeployment of troops would be their top priority when the new Congress convenes in January, even before an investigation of the conduct of the war.

"We need to begin a phased redeployment of forces from Iraq in four to six months," Mr. Levin said in an appearance on the ABC News program "This Week." In a telephone interview later, Mr. Levin added, "The point of this is to signal to the Iraqis that the open-ended commitment is over and that they are going to have to solve their own problems."

This is based on pure numbers, and the moral intent of the voters who may have carefully voted only for the conservative Democrats (or against "corrupt" Republicans) is pitifully irrelevant.

I'm not saying I don't have moral feelings or squeamishness about the Republicans, nor am I saying the voters didn't have them; just that the reasons pale in comparison to the numbers.

It's why I voted for a candidate for whom I otherwise would not have voted, and it's why I suggested wearing noseclips to the polls.

People who think there are more important things than winning should have asked whether that would lead to a moral victory in Iraq.

Whoops, I keep forgetting!

War wasn't the issue.

(Sorry.)

UPDATE: I guess even in my worst cynicism I forget that there are actually people who believe in the morality in defeat. Via Glenn Reynolds, here's Josh Manchester:

In Mr. Carroll's fantasyland, the United States is deserving of defeat, and through some sort of mental gymnastics, that defeat is honorable, because it smacked of hubris to ever have fought in the first place.

[...]

It is difficult not to conclude that there is a class of well-intentioned individuals in the United States like him who don't merely feel as they do upon witnessing a defeat, but instead think this way all the time. Like it or not, this mentality of permanent defeat plays a large part in the Democratic Party. It is now up to President Bush and the new Democratic congressional leadership to see that it does not become dominant.

More of an optimist than I am, Manchester suggests how this might be made to occur:
How to do so? A charm offensive is not quite what is necessary. Instead, perhaps a combination of sobering events that will impress upon Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid the gravity of our current situation would do the trick. Why not invite both Pelosi and Reid to the White House every morning until the new Congress is sworn in - and ask them to listen with the President to his Presidential Daily Brief, describing what Al Qaeda has cooked up of late? Or, why not invite them along with the President to one of his private sessions with the families of those who have paid the ultimate price overseas? Speaking of those overseas whose lives hang upon American policy, Pelosi and Reid could be participants in the next conference call that Bush has with Iraqi Prime Minister Maliki.
That would be a good thing, but isn't there an assumption that these are not moral defeatists, but are instead good people who believe in their hearts that victory is preferable to defeat? That's not something I saw much in the anti-Vietnam War crowd (most of whom believe the US deserved to lose for waging an evil war) but I guess I shouldn't be using the Vietnam antiwar people as an absolute yardstick.

I agree wholeheartedly with Josh Manchester's conclusion:

Leaving Iraq will be worse than leaving Vietnam, not necessarily in terms of bloodshed, though that will be no comfort to those who will be slaughtered, but because the jihadist threat today is more dangerous than the Soviet threat then. Despite lacking - so far - in similar capabilities to the Communists, our enemies more than make up for it with an insatiable bloodthirsty ruthlessness. The honor that Mr. Carroll sees in defeat will soon be forgotten should Al Qaeda establish a caliphate in Anbar Province and begin a healthy trade in the export of mayhem throughout the West. The Furies that will visit us from such a redoubt will engender much more than a little longing that we had stayed.
Being depressed might be a healthy reaction.

Perhaps I should try to figure out how to be in denial.

MORE: On Saturday, the enemy's chief spokesman in Iraq was reported to be gloating:

BAGHDAD - A new recording yesterday attributed to the leader of al-Qaeda in Iraq mocked President Bush as a coward whose conduct of the war was rejected at the polls, challenging him to keep U.S. troops in the country to face more bloodshed.

"We haven't had enough of your blood yet," taunted Abu Hamza al-Muhajir, identified as the speaker on the tape.

He gloated over Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld's resignation, claimed to have 12,000 fighters under his command who "have vowed to die for God's sake," and said his fighters would not rest until they blow up the White House and occupy Jerusalem.

It was impossible to verify the authenticity of the 20-minute recording, posted on a Web site used by Islamic extremists. The CIA said technical analysis was being conducted on the tape.

Muhajir, an Egyptian also known as Abu Ayyub al-Masri, boasted that al-Qaeda in Iraq was moving toward victory faster than expected because of Bush's mistakes.

And that was before today's wonderful news.

Sigh.

I guess Michael Moore predicted that Iraq's "Minutemen" would win.

I'll say this for the people who think like him. While I completely disagree with them, at least they're honest enough to admit that US defeat is what they want.

UPDATE (11/14/06): I like Roger L. Simon's take on things:

Things seem to me to be spinning out of control at the moment.
And how.

posted by Eric on 11.13.06 at 07:59 AM










Comments

I used to think that the leftists "supported" the troops...that is until they were asked to actually DO anything.

I have come to believe that leftists do indeed support the troops...as long as they are fighting against the US or Israel.

cf bleachers   ·  November 13, 2006 2:45 PM

I understand your dismay, I feel the same thing. Asking a bunch of Congressmen, who never look further than the next election, to think of the long term consequences of any action they take, to do the right thing has been laughable for a while, and only gets worse.
Sadder still, is that far too many Americans no longer consider their vote worth the effort, or think about the totality of their vote. Whether they were one issue voters or not, they are getting a whole package.

This is my second tour In Iraq, and I can honestly say progress has been made, though not as much nor as quickly as first hoped. If we leave, we concede the field to a merciless enemy who gives no quarter, and we betray the efforts of a brave core of Iraqis who have thrown in their lot and tried to stabilize and rebuild their country. We'''d better be wiling to take in a lot of refugees, or bve prepared to stomach the sight of the atrocities that will result if we allow sectarian violence and Al-Qaeda terrorism to run unchecked in Iraq without A US military presence.

As much as I do not wish to stay here any longer, or wish to return once I have left, I fear that a too quick, and obviously unplanned an il-conceived withdrawal will only hurt us in the long term by damaging our credibility, and diminishing our strength and influence. Not only in the Middle East, but around the world. Once the world sees our lack of resolve and lack of perserverance, they will no longer respect us, fear us, or take us seriously.

I am torn between sorrow and disgust when I see the leaders of my country so ready to admit defeat for a few more popularity points and a shot at poitical dominance at home.

Americans, you voted them in, you'd better pay attention and hold them accountable, they will sow, we will all reap.

SFC SKI   ·  November 13, 2006 3:24 PM

Hang in there SFC! I'm glad you visited this blog and shared your thoughts. And thanks for everything you've done for the country!

Eric Scheie   ·  November 13, 2006 9:54 PM

Post a comment


April 2011
Sun Mon Tue Wed Thu Fri Sat
          1 2
3 4 5 6 7 8 9
10 11 12 13 14 15 16
17 18 19 20 21 22 23
24 25 26 27 28 29 30

ANCIENT (AND MODERN)
WORLD-WIDE CALENDAR


Search the Site


E-mail

escheie_[AT]_yahoo_DOT_com



Classics To Go

Classical Values PDA Link

What ancient form of execution would you LEAST prefer?
Buried alive
Crucifixion
Flayed alive
Scourged to death
Stung/bitten to death by insects
Slow disembowelment
Roasted on grill
Dragged from chariot
Torn apart by wild beasts
Rolled downhill inside spiked barrel
Death of a thousand cuts
  
Free polls from Pollhost.com


Archives



Recent Entries



Links



Alphecca (My Blogdaddy)



Puff the Protector



Gays in Military Site

Middle East Media Research Institute

Gay Libertarian Site
The Bitch Girls
Join the NRA!


SECOND AMENDMENT VIDEO!

Shooters' Carnival

Tammy Bruce
Gun Owners of America
goalogox.gif

front_cover.jpg
KerryCom.gif
fighting101sSm.jpg
David Hackworth
ElectricVenom.com
SgtStryker.com
Hell In A Handbasket
Matt Welch
The Volokh Conspiracy
Virginia Postrel
PseudoPsalms
The Light of Reason
The Anger of Compassion
Anger Management
Dustbury.com
Rachel Lucas
Shadow Government
reflections in d minor
JustOneMinute
Boone Country
Catallarchy
Roger L. Simon Button
Agenda Bender
Mike Silverman
Steven Malcolm Anderson
Walter in Denver
Impearls
Donald Sensing
Howard Owens
Loco Parentis
imao15.jpg
Colby Cosh
VodkaPundit
Radley Balko
Dean's World
The Queen of All Evil
baldilocks
Joe Gandelman
Dave Tepper
Begging to Differ
Kesher Talk
Jeff Jarvis
Doc Searls
Little Green Footballs
Captain Ed
Oh, That Liberal Media!
ICANNfocus.org
God of the Machine
Sandefur's Freespace
Wizbang
Robert Prather
LawPundit
adrcircle.jpgThe Anti-Idiotarian Rottweiler
Amygdala
bilious young fogey
MadLab
On the Fritz
why dave bergman is neat
Skiplog
Clowning Glory
Dispatches from the Culture Wars
Where in Washington, D.C. is Sun Myung Moon?
Anti-Socialist Tendencies
Of Interest
WICKED THOUGHTS
Setting The World To Rights
doubleplusgood infotainment
It Can't Rain All The Time
Scrutineer
Nick Danger, International Man of Mystery
seldom sober
TRITICALE
Random Jottings
Graham Lester
point2point
Shark Blog
Gene Healy
Discount Blogger
Six Foot Pole
Dodgeblogium
Across the Atlantic
The Imperialist Dog
Lex Talionis
Mind Of Mog
Say Uncle
CAMPVS MAWRTIVS
res gestae dionysii
Annika's Journal & Poetry
A :{FRUSTRATED}: ARTIST
Yet another weird SF fan
Lincoln Cat
The Meatriarchy
Who is Ronald?
Short Daddy
Punch Drunk
Mookie Riffic
On The Third Hand
MatthewEdgar.net
ZenPundit
Jennifer's History and Stuff
blogcrit-button.gif
argghhh!!!
Modulator
D.C. Thornton
Centerfield
Asymmetrical Information
Airline Pilots Security Assn
Relapsed Catholic
PAPADOC
Abraca-Pocus
The Pryhills
Winds of Change
Daily Pundit
The Speculist
Regnum Crucis
The Elfin Ethicist
Classics in Contemporary Culture
elephant-rabbits
A Perfectly Cromulent Blog
allied
Parableman
Southern Musings
CALIFORNIA YANKEE
Allen's Arena
Ex-Gay Watch
Jonno
Michael Moore doesn't love me!
Eschaton
Clayton Cramer
Letters From a Strip of Dirt
Oliver Willis
Hesiod Theogeny
Dr Zen
JunkYardBlog
Orcinus
Andrew Sullivan
Ideofact
Letter from Gotham
Oraculations
INCITE
Positive Liberty
ALLAH IS IN THE HOUSE
Tiny Little Lies
My So-Called Penis
Keith Devens
Jason Holliston
W(h)ine Country
Straight White Guy
Ken MacLeod
Lawrence Lessig
solomonia.com/blog/
PaleoJudaica.com
EdCone.com
Common Sense and Wonder
Who knew?
Daily Howler
James Landrith
Chief Wiggles
L.T. Smash
damnum absque injuria
Daniel W. Drezner
OxBlog
Reason of Voice
Steven Den Beste
Wonkette!
Cranial Cavity
Gibberish in Neutral
DramaQueen
vivalabloog
Classics in Contemporary Culture
The LLama Butchers
flvbutton.gif
HobbsOnLine
ACIDMAN
Sector 7-G
Zogby Blog
mtpolitics.net
Horologium
Civic Dialogues
Practical Penumbra
Right Wing News
Stranger in a Strange Land
Ambient Irony
Tiger: Raggin' & Rantin'
Read My Lips
Jay Solo
The Alliance
The Smallest Minority
Wrong Side of Happiness
Wince and Nod
One Little Victory
Fishbucket
suburban blight
Sketches of Strain
Boi from Troy
Being American in T.O.
Outside the Beltway
One Fine Jay
Bill and Kent's Place on the Web
Burton Terrace
This Book Stinks
The Happy Carpenter
Political Correctness Watch
GREENIE WATCH
Resource.full
This Liberal"
Brainville
BLAMBLOG
Ordinary Galoot
QandO
Josh Cohen
Extra Ordinary Ideas
brykMantra
Croooow Blog
Old Right
commiewatch
Yourishweb.jpg
Proculian Meditations
UggaBugga
Dustin the No-Longer-Blogless
Les Jones Blog
Temporal Globe
Postcards from Nowhere
Tarazet
Unfogged
Synthstuff
Riba Rambles
Mitch Berg
The National Debate
scha-den-freu-de
Ocean Guy
Topic Exchange
CELESTIAL OFFERINGS
Texas Native
Somewhere over the Rainbough
Why read this?
End NPR Bias
Ace of Spades HQ
Web Dawn
GANGSTORIES
Sheila Astray's Redheaded Ramblings
Alan Sullivan (Seablogger)
hobbyblog
activistchat.com/blogiran/
FuturePundit.com
Tim Blair
A Voyage To Arcturus
HipperCritical
BarlowFriendz
Jihad Watch
Kin's Kouch
Bad Money
The Campblog
News Junkie Canada
De Doc's Doings
Bigwig
Eject!Eject!Eject!
Tom's Nap Room
A Coon Cat's World
The sexual adventures of Woodie and Peaches
Crystalline Ceramics Web Resource
Heh. Indeed.
NakedVillainy.com
Andrew David Chamberlain
The Karmic Inquisition
Adam Smith Institute Weblog
Andrea Harris
Hi. I'm Black
Banana Oil
Jim Miller on Politics
Who Tends the Fires
Ranck and File
MOLOTOV COCKTAIL FRANK
NOLI IRRITARE LEONES
Miss O'Hara
deadmaus
Coffee With Rhoads
robot guy
Travelling Shoes
Admiral Quixote's Roundtable
danm.us
The Argus
Dissecting Leftism
Dissecting Leftism -- OLD Site
Aaron's cc
Commentariat
The Argus - Registan
INDC Journal
Pundit Ex Machina
DeMythology
Peppermint Tea
Gilly's World
Beyond the Black Hole
La Shawn Barber"
FREE IRAN NEWS button
Perverse Access Memory
Invisible Adjunct
Photon Courier
Intel Dump
Junkscience.com
The SmarterCop
Laban Tall
Banagor
Peeve Farm
Rand Simberg
camedwards.com
Kim du Toit
Mrs. du Toit
Dancing with Dogs
Two--Four
Heretical Ideas
Astonished Head
Outlandish Josh
Central Oregon for Dean
ghostofaflea.com
The White Peril 白禍 (Sean Kinsell)
www.blktlr.com
Subterranean Bungalo
DFMoore
Dave Halliday
Well Versed
Qoheleth 60: Joel Moody's Repository
quo vado
jonrowe.blogspot.com
yellopad
Sticks of Fire
Dissecting Leftism
ByteMagick
Blogs of War
PRESTOPUNDIT
Of Interest
The Meatriarchy
Bernhardt Varenius
The Forager
Miller?s Time
Blogs of War
painting to stay (?) sane
Blue Goldfish | Surface
Clowning Glory
House of Payne International
Last Chance Caf馬t;/a>
Psychology of Leftism
a_sdf
CONSERVATISM/RIGHTISM
Taylor & Company
The Vicious Circle
Leftists as Elitists
Eye of the Storm
A scratch area
Wicked Thoughts
Filtrat
The Bayou City Perspective
The Belfry Blogger
Setting The World To Rights
Ljonn.com
Oddly Normal
Varifrank
Jamie Jamison on Technology
GayPatriot
A New York Escorts Confessions
jamescalvin.com
The Eleven Day Empire
Dr. Rusty Shackleford
Eric's Grumles Before The Grave
Belmont Club
Gumbo Pie
BeldarBlog
MooreThoughts
Blind Adherence
Last One Speaks
Logic Monkey
Bird's Eye View
DIRTY WATER
Forgadring
precision-guided cowboy
Punditmania
Minor Thoughts
Just Askin'
HispaLibertas
Let's Try Freedom
Megan McArdle
Ann Althouse
Beautiful Atrocities
Sean Hackbarth
Power and Control
Professor Bainbridge
Power Line
Dialogic
Darleen's Place
I'm N.O. Pundit!
Done With Mirrors
AMERICAN FUTURE
CodeBlueBlog
Gay Orbit
Urthshu
Zacht Ei
Interested-Participant
blake taylor
The Anchoress
Freespeech.com
Spiked
Decision '08 (Mark Coffey)
White Lightning Axiom: Redux
The Big Picture
Rachel Lucas BEI
John Cole
Haight Speech
evolution: on the loose
Moderates of all Nations, Unite!
Jeff Gannon
THE GLEESON BLOGLOMERATE
Pajama Pundits
Centerpiece
The Radical Centrist
Lab-Tested
FreedomSight
AmbivaBlog
evolution
Marx & Friends in their own words
Elective Application
Religion Research Islam Blog
YOUNGPUNDIT.COM
{finding peace in the chaos}
IQ & PC -- By Chris Brand
Classics in Contemporary Culture
Morse's Code
A&W
Bench Marx
Julie Neidlinger
Shades of Gray
The Daily Lion: NeoLibertarianism on a Stick
Miller's Time
Centerpiece
This Liberal
Coming Anarchy
Lay Lines
that'sRich
the blog eclectic
booklore
Yankee Madmen
Jesusland Expatriate
Amazing Motor Girls
Spiced Sass
Decline and Fall of Western Civilization
Modern Crusader
MaroonBlog
Skriblerier, etc.
I am partially fused with infinity
Eros Colored Glasses
Bill Peschel: The man comes around
The Twins Tell the Truth
wickens.ca
The War of Ideas
ConsterNations
EaglesUp Blog
Vitriolics Anonymous
DIRTY WATER
Mean Mr. Mustard 2.0
EDUCATION WATCH
THE RIGHT SCALE
AIS Knight Hammer
SOCIALIZED MEDICINE
The Argus
DON'T BE DUMB!
Blue Goldfish | Surface
GUN WATCH
De Docs Institute for Memetic Engineering And Polymaths...
Wordpress Test Weblog
Kapowie Zone
Political Theory: Weblogs
You know, they say...
all blogged down
Harkonnendog
Big Dirigible
GeoPoliticalreview.com
Coyote Blog
Blog Retrofuturistic
VietPundit
JasonColeman.com
Logical Meme
Bloggledygook
Discursive Recursions
Bird's Eye View
Right Wing Nut House
ELEMENOHPEE
Locusts and Honey
Moonbattery
The Everlasting Phelps
Mythusmage Opines
The Cassandra Page
Of Arms & the Law
The Daily Bork
Strange Stuff
Another Gay Republican
Libertarian Man of Mystery
Liberty Just In Case
TalkLeft
Joe's Dartblog
Iowa Hawk
The Common Room
Darth Vader
Gay Bipolar Republican
Boxing Alcibiades
Baby TrollBlog
Strange Fictions
Urban Hermit
The Eye of Polyphemus
Toe In The Water
Bryan's Basement
Fishkite
Right on the Left Coast
Beltway Buzz
pike speak
Scared Monkeys
The Mudville Gazette
Matt Sheffield
Undercaffeinated
Trey Jackson
NashvilleFiles.com
Moonbat Central
Dust my Broom
The Cliffs of Insanity
Riding Sun
The Modo Blog
Philly Future
philly
Off In The Tall Weeds
Doug Petch.Com
Gays for Life
the True Nature of Reality
Spinning Clio
Mike Huckabee President 2008
A.E.Brain
that rogueclassicist guy
A M㯠Invis�l
Constantly Risking Absurdity
Laurence Simon
Notes & Musings
A World of Speculation
Weird Events
Pit Bull Wars
New World Man
Mark in Mexico
The Palmetto Pundit
All Things Jen(nifer)
Generic Confusion
Justus for All
iHillary
Michael Totten
Don Surber
Maggie's Farm
Unpaid Punditry Corps
The Counter Hippie
Kicking On Doors
FunnyBusiness
Restless Mania
Mark Tapscott
nobody sasses a girl in glasses
Letters from the Bostonian Exile
The Education Wonks
Diana Hseih
just muttering
Right-Wing of the Gods
Michelle Malkin
Inside Larry's Head
Ballpoint Wren
A Blog For All
The Liberal Wrong
American Outlook
Splog Reporter
From the Grand Stand
Tinabell
Affordable Housing Institute
mudphud
Living In The Past
Searchlight Crusade
Gus Van Horn
Ian Schwartz
One Billion Red Chinese and a Dog Named Liberty
Suburban Bourgeois
The Metropolis Times
DR. HELEN
Philadelphia AIDS Thrift
Sir Humphrey's
Birth Story
The Simplest Thing
Blue Star Chronicles
One Stack Mind
Cathy Young
Neocon Express
A A R D V A R K
World Climate Report
Apartment 604
Yelling at the Windshield
Kimdergarten/
ShrinkWrapped
The Bear Cave
X marks the blogspot
CARRY ON AMERICA
Jim Rose
Kiril, The Mad Macedonian
Signal 94
Pseudo-Polymath
The International Libertarian
Gates of Vienna
California Sojourn
The Liberty Papers
Barcepundit
A. Jacksonian
Jon Swift
Tim Maguire
Three Sticks
Asymmetric
Dog Politics
OregonGuy
Little Miss Attila
Buuuuurrrrning Hot
AGENT BEDHEAD
Tygrrrr Express
David Harsanyi
Snowflakes in Hell
Earnest Iconoclast
Eternity Road
Musings of the GeekWithA.45
Total Survivalist Libertarian Rantfest
Argue With Everyone Political Forum
Nathan J. Winograd
Assistant Village Idiot
Parkway Rest Stop
Grouchy Old Cripple
Technicalities
Coalition of the Swilling
TigerHawk
Mary Madigan
Sad Old Goth
Erica Sherman
Joated

Ezra Levant
Kathy Shaidle
Free Dominion
Small Dead Animals
Habitation of Justice
GAYS DEFEND MARRIAGE
IEC Fusion Technology Blog
John Bambenek
Adventures in Existence
The Discerning Observer
Economists for McCain
Opining Online
The North Coast
the CAMPVS
The Michigan Review
FMG
Kejda Gjermani
South Carolina

American Glob
Breitbart.com
BigHollywood
BigGovernment
Memeorandum
Le Quebecois Libre
Right Thinking
Freeman Hunt
Crossroads Arabia
Mad Genius Club
Washington Rebel
The Vail Spot
Windy Acres Tales
Diogenes Borealis
The Campblog
RightMichigan.com
The Truth Laid Bear
The Pungeoning
Kagogi the Destroyer
Socrates' Academy
jpfoUSA.gif
Armed and Dangerous

SupportDenmarkSmall2EN.png
holocausthp.jpg

Vin Suprynowicz


Tongue Tied
Link to Samizdata - please save the button to your own 

server

My Watergate Blog

rhino_sm.jpg



pj-button-04.gif

The Neolibertarian Network

BUMPERBANstupsm_1_.jpg



Syndicate this site (XML)






Search Popdex:


Pssst!

Wanna get on the Classical Values blogroll?

linkhead.gif Don?t bang your head!

Please send me an email and let me know, because although I try to keep up, sometimes I have trouble finding every last link.



Site Credits

Normal 0 MicrosoftInternetExplorer4 /* Style Definitions */ table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para-margin:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman";}

classicalvalues.com

classicalvalues.com

(Link buttons)