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August 05, 2008
Not A Citizen?
Commenter Jane at Just One Minute posted this interesting e-mail she received. Barack Obama is not a legal U.S. natural-born citizen according to the law on the books at the time of his birth, which falls between December 24, 1952, to November 13, 1986. Federal Law requires that the office of President requires a natural-born citizen if the child was not born to two U.S. Citizen parents. This is what exempts John McCain, though he was born in the US Panama Canal Zone.Now I'm starting to see why the birth certificate issue is so important. It would list his father. It also explains Bill Clinton's statement: "I never was mad at Sen. Obama. I think everybody's got a right to run for president who qualifies under the Constitution. Which may mean the forgery issue re: the birth certificate is a red herring. The real issue is who is your daddy? So the question is: was Hawaii a State when Obama was born? He says he is 46 years old. That would be 1962. Hawaii became a State on August 21, 1959. Well that blows that theory. If he was born in the USA he is an American citizen. Period. OTOH commenter Sarah had this to say: As a genealogist, I could not list Barack Obama Sr. as the legal father since he was never "legally" married to Barack's mother. He was already married. So technically Barack would be considered illegitimate, a more complicated matter back in 1961 than today.Texas Darlin looks at the citizenship angle from the adoption point of view. What does all this mean? Maybe nothing. All Barry has to do to scotch the rumors is to release his birth records. If he does have dual citizenship that will cause him problems with a lot of the electorate. If he is not an American citizen it is all over for him. Cross Posted at Power and Control posted by Simon on 08.05.08 at 06:36 PM
Comments
Jardinero1, What are the rules about adoption by a non-citizen? BTW I have no beliefs about the issue one way or the other. My question is, considering all the smoke on the issue why hasn't he produced an authentic birth certificate(BC)? Suppose according to his birth certificate his real name is Soetoro and he never legally changed it. That might mean he is not even a US Senator, depending on the law. In some states you can be on the ballot with an assumed name, but you have to file the proper papers. M. Simon · August 5, 2008 09:30 PM All I can say is read all the sections of sub-chapter III and decide for yourself. If there is any case law on the subject, I would love to hear about it. I think the adoption thing is a red herring and has no impact on whether he is a natural born citizen. My spin on it, after reading Chapter III is that the only salient facts are: is the mother a citizen and did she ever reside in the USA. With regard to Obama, the answer is affirmative on both counts. Unless his mother is not his mother, he is a citizen. I think the issue of an original birth certificate is a canard. Not everybody has their birth legally recorded. I can't speak for other states but, in Texas, birth certificates can be altered and even created out of thin air through a legal process. I have a cousin whose birth was never recorded. His mom never got around to it. His sibling's births are recorded. He is applying for a passport now and has to have a birth certificate legally created. It involves collecting affidavits from relatives who are older than you and then submitting them in the county where you were born. Jardinero1 · August 5, 2008 11:05 PM Can't anyone file a lawsuit to see his birth certificate. He is hidding something.......... john sterczek · August 6, 2008 09:42 AM Can't anyone file a lawsuit to see his birth certificate. He is hidding something.......... john sterczek · August 6, 2008 09:43 AM If Obama was indeed born in Hawaii in 1961, nothing else matters. Not his parents' marital status, not any subsequent adoptions, not his mom's age--none of it. Born in US equals citizen (that's where anchor babies come from). There really isn't any other question. Unless somebody can come up with evidence that the birth announcement in the local paper Jim Geraghty linked to the other day was a fraud, there's simply no "there" there. Watchman · August 7, 2008 01:26 AM Here's the deal on this. Under US law if you are born in the US you are a natural born citizen. If another country chooses to recognize you as its citizen also, you are still a US citizen. A five year old cannot surrender his citizenship: he isn't recognized as having the legal ability to do that. The US is not bound by Indonesian law. Here's another thing. Where is Lolo Soetero alleged to have adopted Barack? And while a Catholic School registration is an interesting document, it is NOT an Indonesian state document. Meaning, that Lolo could have put down anything whether true or not. Under common law, a man can call himself by whatever name he chooses. That is not fraud. I am also constrained to point out that I have to wonder why in the world, with its negative connotations, that "Barack Hussein Obama" would purposefully bill himself with the name "Hussein" if it really wasn't his name. As for candidacies, I am constrained to point out that several candidates for President didn't run under their real names, including Jimmy Carter, Mitt Romney, Pat Robertson, and Dan Quayle. Furthermore, neither William Jefferson Clinton or Gerald Ford were born with those names. It's a very curious exercise, but Obama is already open about his diverse childhood background, so none of this is really a surprise. By his own bio, Obama claims to have been born in a specific hospital in Honolulu. The "Barry Soetero" document confirms that he was born in Hawaii... this is supporting evidence that can be used to assert natural born citizenship. I don't see where much of anything is being "hidden". So he used an Indonesian passport in his teens. So what? I also concur that because his mother was a US citizen, where he was actually born is irrelevant. Liz Michael · August 14, 2008 03:56 PM |
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Jane, TexasDarlin and Sarah appear to be making up new sections for the US Code. Commenters who quote the law should state which law or legal opinion they are quoting. As I posted earlier it does not matter where he was born and whether his parents were married. US Code: Title 8, Chapter 12, Sub-chapter III is what applies to Obama as well as any relevant caselaw therefrom. The code is quite specific as to what time periods apply to specific groups of people and places.
If Obama was born out of Wedlock then US Code: Title 8, Chapter 12, Sub-chapter III, Part 1, Section 1409, Paragraph c would apply:
"(c) Notwithstanding the provision of subsection (a) of this section, a person born, after December 23, 1952, outside the United States and out of wedlock shall be held to have acquired at birth the nationality status of his mother, if the mother had the nationality of the United States at the time of such person’s birth, and if the mother had previously been physically present in the United States or one of its outlying possessions for a continuous period of one year." It's all about who the mother is, and there is no "5 years of US residence beyond the age of 16 rule".
If his parents were married then section 1401 applies. Whichever section applies, he is a natural born citizen, no matter where he was born. His mother was always a citizen, read Section 1405.