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March 06, 2004
Divine pursuits ARE Classical! (while embracing death is "Kassical"!)
Here's Virginia Postrel on the Kass Council: This sort of indirect genetic evidence for human evolution is going to pile up until it resembles the overwhelming geological case against believing the earth is a few thousand years old. More important, and more interesting, will be how understanding the genetic origins of brain functions lets us affect how our minds work. With the Kass Commission hot to talk about brains, can proposals for new criminal laws against neuroscience be far behind? After all, that research might threaten classical conceptions of the mind. And if they were good enough for Plato, they're good enough for us.The ancients would be turning in their grave! But seriously, I don't think that "classical conceptions of the mind" are really the problem. Rather, the problem is "Kassical conceptions of the mind"! Our argument is not with Plato, it's with Kass as Plato's spokesman. Unless Kass knows more about Plato than Plato himself, I don't recall reading anything in Plato which gave Kass permission to summon him from the dead, stuff words in his mouth, and then bootstrap that into big government edicts which We Must Live By. (And die by!) Plato was a classical thinker, but there were many others. Thought did not stop with ancient philosophers -- much less any particular one. They died, though, and their thoughts reflected the sum total of knowledge available to them during the times in which they lived. While we stand on their shoulders philosophically (please read my cautionary essay about not throwing the classical baby out with the medieval bathwater), their words and thoughts do not bind us. Reading them is a great way to gain great insight, but I think they ought to be allowed to speak for themselves, and be evaluated accordingly. Kass has no monopoly on ancient thought. What I do not like about Leon Kass is that he is not just an ordinary classics teacher with odd opinions. He sits in an elevated position of authority -- waiting for the next opportunity to tell us what to do. And to do that, he invokes the ancients, not to encourage the pursuit of such things as wisdom and truth, but to set rules and limits. Plato was a student of Socrates, who was the first to admit that he knew very little, but questioned a great deal. This picking and choosing of Plato and Aristotle reminds me of the Quotations from Chairman Mao. I think it is a perversion of ancient thought. Take the notion of immortality, for example. Leon Kass would have us believe that because flowers die, and because he is an expert on Plato, that immortality is bad. Although Plato and Socrates did not agree on immortality (Socrates tended towards the view that the soul was not immortal -- his "agnosticism about the soul’s fate after death in Apology 40c may reflect that dialogue’s emphasis on the avoidance of unjustified claims to knowledge"), Aristotle, on the other hand, thought that the pursuit of immortality was a good thing: Aristotle did not take up the Platonic project of proving the soul’s immortality or of providing eternal rewards for virtuous conduct. Indeed, by defining the soul as the ‘first actuality of an organic living body’ (On the Soul II 1), he seems to have precluded the possibility that any soul can survive the dissolution of the body whose actuality it is. Two lines of thought complicate this story and seem to make room for some immortal element in the soul. The first is the caveat, stated twice (On the Soul I 1, II 1), that the continued existence of any part of the soul in separation from the body is impossible, unless there is some activity of the soul that is not a complex activity of the soul and body: thinking is explicitly offered as a possible example of this, in contrast to such activities as feeling fear or anger, which clearly involve psycho-physical cooperation. The second and related complication is that in his analysis of intellect and intellectual thought (On the Soul III 4–5), Aristotle refers to a mind that is ‘immortal and eternal’ and is somehow involved in human thought. If we connect these two strands together, we may conclude that we have found something like the rational part of an individual human being’s soul and that we are being assured of its immortality. However, another line of interpretation will make this immortal and eternal mind (what later tradition calls the ‘active intellect’) a force external to the individual, whether a divinity that may be personal in its own right or a reservoir of impersonal thinking power. On views of this sort, what Aristotle is offering us falls far short of anything that might be considered personal survival (see Aristotle §§16, 19).Perhaps that's why Kass prefers flowers. posted by Eric on 03.06.04 at 06:11 PM
Comments
Postrel takes a few lines from Kass ... Elizabeth Blackburn ... has been replaced by ... Ben Carson, chair of pediatric neurosurgery at Johns Hopkins Medical Center. .... Most fundamentally, this change reflects the changing focus of the council's work, as we move away from issues of reproduction and genetics to focus on issues of neuroscience, brain and behavior. .... Peter Lawler, a distinguished political philosopher and student of American government, has written searchingly about the psychology of mood-altering drugs and the way the growing use of such drugs might affect the character of American society. ... and she hysterically responds: With the Kass Commission hot to talk about brains, can proposals for new criminal laws against neuroscience be far behind? After all, that research might threaten classical conceptions of the mind. And if they were good enough for Plato, they're good enough for us. ... and then you compound her error: I don't think that "classical conceptions of the mind" are really the problem. Rather, the problem is "Kassical conceptions of the mind"! Our argument is not with Plato, it's with Kass as Plato's spokesman. Unless Kass knows more about Plato than Plato himself, I don't recall reading anything in Plato which gave Kass permission to summon him from the dead, stuff words in his mouth, and then bootstrap that into big government edicts which We Must Live By. (And die by!) .... This picking and choosing of Plato and Aristotle reminds me of the Quotations from Chairman Mao. I think it is a perversion of ancient thought. - The bioethics council changes its focus to "neuroscience, brain and behavior," and Postrel wants to pretend this signals their intention to enact "new criminal laws against neuroscience". Does this even require refutation? I don't think so, at least not until Postrel substantiates her accusation. - You write that "our argument is not with Plato, it's with Kass as Plato's spokesman." The only mention of Plato in any of the linked items is made by ... Postrel. - You write, "unless Kass knows more about Plato than Plato himself, I don't recall reading anything in Plato which gave Kass permission to summon him from the dead, stuff words in his mouth, and then bootstrap that into big government edicts which We Must Live By." Those would be excellent points if Kass: a) pretended to know more about Plato than Plato himself, But Kass didn't mention, quote or otherwise attempt to channel Plato in the cited articles. Unless Kass authorized you to do to him everything you say he does to Plato, maybe you should restrict yourself to criticizing what Kass actually says. - You write, "[Kass'] picking and choosing of Plato and Aristotle reminds me of the Quotations from Chairman Mao. I think it is a perversion of ancient thought." Isn't it perverse to say this when Kass doesn't even cite Plato and Aristotle in the linked pieces? - You write, "[ancient philosophers'] words and thoughts do not bind us. Reading them is a great way to gain great insight, but I think they ought to be allowed to speak for themselves, and be evaluated accordingly. Kass has no monopoly on ancient thought." When did Kass say that Plato's words bind us? And when did Kass say or imply that he has a monopoly on ancient thought. Do you disagree with a specific misinterpretation he's made of Plato or Aristotle? Then quote his argument and explain his mistake. There is a difference between interpreting a philosopher in a way you find mistaken and claiming a "monopoloy on ancient thought." - You write, "Aristotle ... thought that the pursuit of immortality was a good thing," and you then cite an encyclopedia article that doesn't support the view that he was referring to physical immortality. Quite the opposite: "Immortality has here come unmoored from survival after death or eternal existence and now simply denotes a kind of activity that a participant may share in for finite, even fleeting, periods of time." It is a little amazing that you (groundlessly) attack Kass for selectively citing Plato and Aristotle and then cap off your critique with a selective misinterpretation of Aristotle. Michael · March 8, 2004 04:47 PM Michael, I think you miss my (and Postrel's) point -- which is that Kass systematically abuses his knowledge of classical philosophy (admittedly more detailed than mine; I do not teach philosophy) to argue that his "wisdom" is grounded in the ancients and is not only superior to our own, but somehow binding. That Kass relies on Plato and Aristotle for his views is not open to serious debate. (Here's one such conservative apprisal -- of many.) I picked and chose from Plato and Aristotle by way of satire in an attempt to demonstrate that like the Quotations from Chairman Mao, the ancients can be cited for a number of propositions. I am not impressed by Kass or anyone else invoking them with a view towards regulating modern science. Thanks for your lengthy comments, and serious research. I wish I had more time to follow up in more serious detail. Eric Scheie · March 17, 2004 10:33 PM |
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